Curse

Dr Strangelove · Jan 27, 2008, 05:03 AM // 05:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendar Muert

Well, my normal setup is Churning earth, earthquake, Sandstorm, Dragons stomp, and obsidian flame to take out whoever is left standing. Normally everyone is dead :P

That setup takes some doing. But ya, I was referring to obsidian flame and earthquake/ds. Obsidian flame rocks...

That is probably a little heavy on exhaustion stuff without [wiki]glyph of energy[/wiki]. Even with it, that seems excessive. May I humbly suggest a build idea stolen from Celestial Beaver that works really well?

[skill]enfeebling blood[/skill][skill]stoning[/skill][skill]earthquake[/skill][skill]unsteady ground[/skill][skill]earth attunement[/skill][skill]glyph of lesser energy[/skill][skill]ward against melee[/skill]variable

with the variable slot being either a rez, [skill]glowstone[/skill], or another ward.

Obsidian flame is a spike skill. Since spikes are irrelevant in PvE, it's kinda pointless IMO.

EDIT: Sweet Jesus, I forgot eruption. Sub out earthquake or something for it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex The Great

hopefully your a better ele than a speaker of english

how2spaek english?????

Kendar Muert · Jan 27, 2008, 05:56 AM // 05:56

I have a build like the one you just posted- I like it alot, but there is something about knocking someone down, keeping them there, and nuking em that I like too much to give up. Thanks though :P

System_Crush · Jan 27, 2008, 09:44 AM // 09:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex the Great

sorry for double post

There's a delete button u know...

I like earth ele's, their utility makes me prefer them over fire, but their damage totals are generally lower than that of a fire ele, sacrificing your effectiveness for utility is generally considered a gimped build.

LightningHell · Jan 27, 2008, 11:23 AM // 11:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by System_Crush

There's a delete button u know...

I like earth ele's, their utility makes me prefer them over fire, but their damage totals are generally lower than that of a fire ele, sacrificing your effectiveness for utility is generally considered a gimped build.

People rarely consider characters with utility "gimped". It all depends on how good the utility is, and the damage that would be sacrificed.

However, contrary to possibly popular opinion, Fire Magic elementalists can very much so carry utility. Quite a bit of it too.

angmar_nite · Jan 27, 2008, 01:43 PM // 13:43

Mind blast in other words. But tbh asides from knockdown I don't find Earth very good utility compared to fire or air.

Kendar Muert · Jan 27, 2008, 04:25 PM // 16:25

If you have a fire bar, you can't really do jack else but damage things. At least the others have SOME shutdown or defense. That's why I prefer other ones than fire the majority of the time, but if I need pure damage, fire is the way to go. That, or an air spike.

Pyro maniac · Jan 27, 2008, 04:27 PM // 16:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendar Muert

If you have a fire bar, you can't really do jack else but damage things. At least the others have SOME shutdown or defense. That's why I prefer other ones than fire the majority of the time, but if I need pure damage, fire is the way to go. That, or an air spike.

fire is support. Unless running Searing Flames, a fire ele always carries aegis/breath of great dwarf/heal party/convert hexes/weapon spells/etc
Air isn't meant to do damage, fast cast air spike has been nerfed since 2005. Air is also utility, blinding > some crap 100 dmg spell.

Stormlord Alex · Jan 27, 2008, 04:45 PM // 16:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendar Muert

If you have a fire bar, you can't really do jack else but damage things. At least the others have SOME shutdown or defense. That's why I prefer other ones than fire the majority of the time, but if I need pure damage, fire is the way to go. That, or an air spike.

Mind Blast disagrees with you. A Fire ele needs MB + rodgort's and, voila! He kills things.

This not only does more damage than other elements, it also leaves half a bar and a good deal of attribute points left to run support and utility. Ohh, and it has infinite energy with which to power that support

Of course, if you were to run a bar of 7 Fire spells and res, you couldn't do much else apart from damage, but that's a really crap build. MB = ftw.

horseradish · Jan 27, 2008, 07:02 PM // 19:02

Earth damage is overshadowed by the damage from Fire Eles, warriors, instagib sins, etc. etc.

Earth Utility is overshadowed by the utility from Air Eles, Water Eles, hybrid Rits, monks, paragons, rangers, etc. etc.

Beastlyman · Jan 27, 2008, 07:37 PM // 19:37

earth magic tanks are incredibly durable if the build is used correctly. Obsidian flesh, stoneflesh aura, and mantra of earth alone could stop nearly any assault. Add in kinetic armor, sliver armor, and some attacks and you could wipe out practically any group

Pyro maniac · Jan 27, 2008, 08:12 PM // 20:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beastlyman

earth magic tanks are incredibly durable if the build is used correctly. Obsidian flesh, stoneflesh aura, and mantra of earth alone could stop nearly any assault. Add in kinetic armor, sliver armor, and some attacks and you are unable to do any damage

fixed
1234567

Akolo · Jan 27, 2008, 08:12 PM // 20:12

as i favor passive defense more than the tank/fire ele/monk trinity, i find earth eles extremily useful.
The ability to have great party support wards and very nice damage dealing spells (including AoE) is ace.
This is if you dont have many other party members providing defense.If you do, i would say leave dmg to dual attunement (or MB) Rodgort spammers

BAM

Beastlyman · Jan 27, 2008, 08:31 PM // 20:31

pyro, look a couple words before you "fixed" it. and add some attacks with the remaining 2 spots. I had already taken into account the low damage, skills like aftershock and earthquake are good alternatives, plus stone daggers for keeping kinetic armor

Pyro maniac · Jan 27, 2008, 08:36 PM // 20:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beastlyman

pyro, look a couple words before you "fixed" it. and add some attacks with the remaining 2 spots. I had already taken into account the low damage, skills like aftershock and earthquake are good alternatives, plus stone daggers for keeping kinetic armor

stone daggers doesn't do damage (well hardly), aftershock is poor damage and requires you to stand in frontline, earthquake costs too much, especially on such bar crowded with high energy spells. also it isn't that good

Kendar Muert · Jan 28, 2008, 12:09 AM // 00:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stormlord Alex

Mind Blast disagrees with you. A Fire ele needs MB + rodgort's and, voila! He kills things.

This not only does more damage than other elements, it also leaves half a bar and a good deal of attribute points left to run support and utility. Ohh, and it has infinite energy with which to power that support

Of course, if you were to run a bar of 7 Fire spells and res, you couldn't do much else apart from damage, but that's a really crap build. MB = ftw.

Mind Blast doesn't support. Actually read what I said. If you are using something else than fire in addition to fire, you arent using just fire, now are you?

Dr Strangelove · Jan 28, 2008, 12:17 AM // 00:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beastlyman

pyro, look a couple words before you "fixed" it. and add some attacks with the remaining 2 spots. I had already taken into account the low damage, skills like aftershock and earthquake are good alternatives, plus stone daggers for keeping kinetic armor

You're not going to kill a thing with those skills. While you're playing glorified yet impotent tank, the rest of your team will be dying. All the armors buffs and whatnot are only good for solo play, they're a complete waste of space in a group.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendar Muert

Midn Blast doesn't support. Actually read what I said. If you are using something else than fire in addition to fire, you arent using just fire, now are you?

That's like saying glyph of lesser energy is bad because there's no expensive stuff you want to spam in energy storage. You're allowed to run multiple attributes, you know.

Kendar Muert · Jan 28, 2008, 12:51 AM // 00:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Strangelove

You're not going to kill a thing with those skills. While you're playing glorified yet impotent tank, the rest of your team will be dying. All the armors buffs and whatnot are only good for solo play, they're a complete waste of space in a group.

That's like saying glyph of lesser energy is bad because there's no expensive stuff you want to spam in energy storage. You're allowed to run multiple attributes, you know.

I know that...

He said my statement was wrong, which it wasn't. Fire HAS NO SUPPORT. Crossing attributes is fine, but the fire line itself has no support! It can give you the ability to utilize other attributes better, true, but the fire line in and of itself has no support. That was all I said.

"If you have a fire bar.."
That implies fire only. Not fire and other stuff.

blue.rellik · Jan 28, 2008, 03:24 AM // 03:24

Well it supports in killing things.....

Kendar Muert · Jan 28, 2008, 04:10 AM // 04:10

That doesn't count..
Support is defending/healing/benefiting your party in some way other than damage.

Dr Strangelove · Jan 28, 2008, 04:36 AM // 04:36

It provides the energy to to other stuff. I really don't know what the argument is about here, there shouldn't be any contention over whether mind blast allows you to run useful utility. This is a fact. No, the one skill by itself does not blind enemies, give your party block, or remove conditions, but it is the framework required to do that.

Framework skills are a part of your build's function. By your logic, earth attunement is a terrible spell because it doesn't directly do damage or provide utility.